Quiz #2
Pols 312: Early Western Thought
Dr. Losco
9/26/2006
Fall Semester 2006
1. Socrates defines the definition of justice as “the
advantage of the stronger” or the will of the stronger however, he
defines the ultimate view of justice as staying out of other’s business
by minding your own business. Socrates believes that if everyone minds
their own business it will create harmony within the city. Socrates
expresses this view of a harmonious city through his comparison of the
city and the soul. There are three cities: simple, luxurious, and good.
The simple city meets all of our basic needs, while the luxurious city
requires the addition of classes because someone is needed to protect
the luxuries, and the good city is filled with philosopher kings who
search for wisdom and ideas like beauty, justice, and the good. Out of
these cities, Socrates looks at the good city. He says there are three
classes in the good city: rulers, guardians, and artisans. He compares
this city to the soul, which also has three classes reason, spirited,
and desirous. He states that the guardian class has wisdom and courage,
moderation extends to all and that justice is to be left to each class
minding his/her own business. Socrates reason for saying justice in the
soul and in the city should be left to one’s own business is that if
each was interfering with the other harmony could not be achieved, but
if all are only concerned with themselves, then harmony will occur, and
this can be achieved just as easily in the city as in the soul.
3. The three great waves that Socrates talks about
that are needed to save the luxurious city are: total equality of men
and women, community of wives and children, and philosopher kings. In
the first wave Socrates believes men and women are equal in all ways
and in everything they do. He believes they should shower together, be
trained together, etc. without eroticism in order to create a sense of
equals. In the second wave, Socrates believes a community of wives and
children should be established in which the whole society is a parent.
A group of the healthiest and wisest would be set aside and taken
somewhere to have children. These children, would then be the children
of the whole community. The birth mother and birth father would not be
married, they would simply be fulfilling a community duty by creating a
child. In the third wave, philosophers would be kings. Political power
and philosophy would coincide. Socrates believes this wave would be the
most daring, because philosophers are thought to be the lowest in real
society. They don’t think like anyone else in society and they deal
with ideas and forms, while the norm of society is to deal with
appearances and things we can touch.
Section II:
Hall’s view of the Republic is that it is a real idea that Socrates
contemplated. This belief is due to the fact that Hall feels we should
read the text in light of historic and social factors and look beyond
the text for answers. For example, Hall sees the Republic as being an
actual possibility because they created a Republic in Sparta and thus
because a republic is possible so is the thought of a philosopher being
a king. Bloom on the other hand feels that when reading the Republic,
we must take the text at its word. He adds that it is a dialogue and a
drama and must be read as a dialogue and a drama, which Hall neglected
to do, resulted in his misinterpretation. He feels that Socrates was
giving Glaucon the example of the Republic to show the very limits of a
perfect Republic. When referring the philosopher king, Bloom states
that nowhere in the text does it talk about the philosopher’s life
being about ruling or that ruling contributes to philosophizing.
Although both authors have legitimate views with
very persuasive points, I tend to agree more with Bloom. I feel that
Bloom has won his case with the sole speech about reading the text as
it is. I feel that it is important to not let personal beliefs and
convictions come into play when reading a text like the Republic for
reasons such as, it wasn’t written in our time period, it was written
about a man who had the capacity to think outside the box more so then
most people today, and if personal beliefs and convictions were allowed
into the reading, nobody would have an agreeable opinion about what
Socrates is trying to say.
Professor Comments: Dr. Losco crossed out my first line in answer
number one; Socrates defines the definition of justice as "the
advantage of the stronger." He also wrote beside that paragraph, "How
viable is this approach for city? for soul?" At the top of the paper he
wrote the grade for my quiz, giving me a 4/5.